Last week I talked about how to deal with feelings of envy towards other people’s financial success or appearance of financial success. I’m probably someone who is extra self-conscious because it really shouldn’t matter what others think of you. You can’t control what others think of you, so why bother worrying about it. I can’t help it. I do. I think this feeling of not wanting others to feel jealous or envious of you is pretty prevalent.
In a recent article, Gaming YourFinances asked whether he should tell friends and family about his goals for financial independence. He surmised then revealing his goals may bring about jealousy and possible loss of friendships. A few weeks back, Done by Forty mentioned that he finished paying his mortgage, but lamented the fact that he could not share with his friends and family this accomplishment. He made an interesting observation that a positive achievement or negative news seemed fine to share, and even certain negative financial topics are generally shared. However, positive financial news like paying off a mortgage felt taboo. Why is that?
I’m not sure why people would be envious of me, I am not debt free (I still have large amount of student loans), I don’t own my house free and clear (I still rent), and it’s not like I’ll be financially independent soon although I’d like to think I am on the right track. Here are a few instances where I’ve felt a little awkward about my finances:
I went to purchase a used vehicle a few years back. When I was told about my financing options, I politely told the person assisting me that I would be paying cash. He seemed to be shocked and commented, “it must be nice to have that much money that you can pay cash.” Sure, $13,000 is a large amount of money, but I had been working 8 years and it pretty much depleted all of my savings. Do I look young? Do most people in their 30s have very little savings. Anyway, I did not want him to think that I had “so much money” that I would lose out on benefits or my bargaining position (even though it was a no-haggle place), so I lied and told him that I borrowed from my 401K. He told me that taking loans from a 401K is not always a good idea! In anycase, I really shouldn’t care what a stranger thinks about my finances.
My son was born two weeks ago and my wife left her job a week before that. We do not know what the future will hold, but we plan on her staying at home with the baby for the near future. When people ask when she will be returning to work and I tell them that she might be staying home for awhile, they openly wonder how we could possibly afford to live on one income. I usually tell people that we are cutting out some expenses and that my wife will look into a side hustle sometime in the future. They tend to assume that I must be making more than I really am, or that I have help from family.
I try to be pretty private with my finances and I never flaunt my money by buying expensive things, so I am usually able to avoid situations where people would feel jealousy towards my financial situation. The above two scenarios were unavoidable though. Well, in my final scenario, I brought on the envy by myself. A co-worker of mine was
complaining about his financial situation and talked about how impossible it was for most people not to live paycheck to paycheck and not struggle financially. Mind you this person makes more than me, has premium cable television, goes out to eat frequently and buys nice clothes. I couldn’t help myself, and once I opened my mouth, I knew I should have kept it shut but I said that I did not live paycheck to paycheck. I said I was frugal with my money and lived within my means. I don’t know what got into me! I really wanted him to see the light and perhaps start reading personal finance blogs. (Not this article though). In the end, he explained that I was more fortunate to have less student loans and not have certain financial obligations that he has. I just let that one go, as I probably should have kept my mouth shut in the first place. Once in a while, he jokingly mentions that I am rich.
Do you talk about your finances with others? What do you do to keep others from being envious of your finances?
I talk about finances with family and one of my coworkers who is in a similar position as I am. Right now i don’t think I have much to be jealous of though. If I talk about trying to save up money or talk about living without debt people just look at me funny. It’s amazing how even paying cash for some of the smaller things I hear people say ‘I wish I could do that”
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I definitely know how you feel. I don’t think I have much to be jealous of either, but even telling my co-worker that I don’t have any credit card debt makes me “rich.”
In the past I made a similar mistake by telling a co-worker we got lucky on our home purchase and it was still worth more than when we bought it. This person actually brought it up a few times in a group setting. It wasn’t a big deal, but I wasn’t comfortable sharing this info with a larger audience. It was a great example of how sharing personal financial info can have unintended results!
Thanks for the link!
GamingYourFinances recently posted…What kind of car do you drive and why?
Yes, that has happened to me. I’ve mentioned things privately to people, though I never specify that I want it private and then they mention it to a larger audience. That’s why I try not to share, but it’s tough sometimes. You do want to share good news.
You’re welcome…and sorry I left out the “Your” in Gaming Your Finances…it’s fixed. I’ll blame that on sleep deprivation =)
No problem!!! Hope everything’s well with baby LRC! 🙂
GamingYourFinances recently posted…What kind of car do you drive and why?
Things are going well. Thanks!
I don’t talk about finances too much, although I do more with my immediate family. If anything, we’re in the opposite position where people think we’re poorer than we are because we choose not to spend money on the things they do. As one example, I just told a friend of mine I wasn’t going to do his fantasy football league because it has a $50 buy-in. I know that his takeaway from that is that we’re struggling, but the reality is that I could easily afford it, I just choose not to. I do worry about what other people think sometimes, but in the end, as you say, it’s just not as important as staying in line with your own goals.
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That’s interesting…I can see how people would think that I’m poorer too because I don’t spend like they do. But some people know that I’m an attorney (though I work in government) and just assume that I make a lot of money (I really don’t). So if I don’t spend that much on things they do, they just assume that I’m cheap! I just can’t win. As for $50 buy in for Fantasy Football, my friends keep on wanting to raise it even higher. I usually vote no. But for $50, it keeps me sufficiently entertained so it’s worth it for me. Plus, I always think that I’ll win the pot or at least get the consolation prize =)
I am comfortable sharing with family about it but i dont see a need to share with co workers. But I would say if you also hear from some one about their progress or achievements then we must use it as motivation and not comparison with them.
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I’m also comfortable with sharing with immediate family. It should be easier for me with co workers as I work in government and our salaries are not really a big secret. But somehow if you’re doing better…then they’re suspicious as to how you did it.
That’s a tough spot to be in: wanting to genuinely help a coworker, but knowing that doing so will kind of “out” you as an outlier…someone who’s not living like everyone else in the office, neighborhood, whatever. It makes you wonder what sort of responsibility we have to share the outlook, techniques & tips we have, because we know it really isn’t that hard to be responsible with money, to live frugally, to invest, etc.. Do we have any obligation to share this lifestyle with others?
Anyway, I don’t think there’s an easy answer — we are probably a ways off from being completely transparent when it comes to money.
Thank you so much for the link and for writing about some of the more emotional/psychological parts of personal finance. They’re my favorite!
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I know…I feel like I have the same dilemma. I really want to share this important knowledge, but it might come off as preachy. I don’t want to sound like I am better than someone else because I choose to live more frugally. I’m also a big fan of the emotional/psychological parts of personal finance.
I am in a similar situation as you. Nothing to be jealous of here, but I do tell my family about my goals for financial independence. They usually laugh as they’re all older, still working, and don’t think it’s possible. My parents have been much more accepting as they know how much I have in the bank. They are supportive so I hope I don’t run into the issue of not being able to share a huge accomplishment with them.
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I’m sure your parents are supportive of your goal and would be proud of the accomplishment. I know what you mean about people not think that it’s possible, but from reading personal finance blogs…I know that it IS possible. It just takes some work.
Oh yes, denial, as I wrote about the other day. They’re all living in denial and they envy the fact that you’ve faced the facts and taken control over your money. We’ve had several instances like the ones you’ve mentioned above, but the most profound I can think of is when my niece was in college and selling for a certain high-end knife company. We picked out a knife we could afford in cash, and she said “Well, auntie, why aren’t you getting the whole set?” I answered “Because we only have the cash available for this one knife.” She said “But, you can just charge it.” I said “Sweetie, we don’t use charge cards. We pay cash for everything.” She looked at me as if I were an alien, completely baffled. It’s sad to me that we are the odd ones, don’t you think?
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I know what you mean. I had a friend ask me why I didn’t buy a nicer phone, television, car, etc as I was just out of college working with more disposable income. I said that I was saving and that I just couldn’t afford it. He said that I could just finance it or use credit cards. You do know that you have to pay it back right?? And those monthly payments may look affordable, but in the end you are paying much more.
I didn’t tell my sisters when I paid off my debt because I was afraid I’d look boastful and they’d feel bad. It’s intersting how we “hide” our successes sometimes (in particular financial success).
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I know, it really is wierd that we have to hide our financial successes. Usually you want to share good news, but for some reason positive financial news can come off as boastful as you mentioned. Well at least you can blog about it =)
Wow, great topic. We are a lot alike. I too am not in an incredibly awesome position.
But I live cheaply. I don’t throw my money around and have been a really good saver for the past few years, therefore, I’m in a good position. When I hear others say things like “I just couldn’t make it without my second job”, I almost want to laugh, but I stay quiet. It’s because they spend like they are dying or something.
I have a sister that stays at home with her two kids. They live on my brother-in-law’s income and do it well. He doesn’t make a killing either. They just have their values in order.
It’s all about values and making the things that matter in life a priority. Family should be a priority instead of “stuff” in my opinion.
Take care,
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Thanks Kraig. I’m also hoping that my wife can stay home with the baby…glad to see others doing it too. You said it best: it’s all about values and making the things that matter in life a priority.
Huh, I never thought of it like that. It’s strange that negative news is fine to share, but positive news, not so much. When it was just us two, we saved up and went to a few really nice vacations – and we got flak for it from some family members – the exact same thing “Must be nice to go on vacation”. And although we tried to explain that we had saved up for it, that almost made it worse. Funny thing is, they were making double what we were (and I’m not exaggerating!). I’ve only discussed my finances with my parents, because I know they’re always supportive. Great post!
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Really, it made it worse when you said you saved up for it? What was their response to that? It is true that many who make more can’t always afford things that some who make less can. It’s not always what you make but what you keep.
They just didn’t want to hear any of it, and were too focused on us going on vacation, saying that they just didn’t have any money left to save. From what I have seen, they certainly haven’t even tried. It’s all about priorities. If you make it a priority, it’ll happen. And it’s so true, it’s not what you make, it’s what you keep.
I don’t talk about finances much and though most people think I am cheap/frugal they never think I am broke. I talk about investing and real estate but its not what interests them so conversations are shorter. You are never going to win honestly and I don’t bother anymore. If I have something to be proud of I know who I can talk to about it. Though you are better off talking to people who understand where you are coming from. This is why the PF community is such a tight group. Most of us understand where others are coming from because they have either been there done that or are going through it and want to get out. Close relatives I don’t talk with about money. Just my rule of thumb.
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It is one major perk of being in the PF community to have like-minded people. Many people just wouldn’t understand or perhaps don’t want to understand.
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I only talk about my finances with my parents and that is about it. The main reason for me is because I get sick of being told that I can “afford” it when discussing buying certain things.
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I know…just because you can “afford” it doesn’t mean it’s a good idea to buy it!
It’s hard sometimes to talk to other people about anything financially. My friends tend to feel as though they are required to spend every dime they earn. But then my bf’s friends and coworkers are super into the middle class lifestyle, where they feel they need it all. And I mean everything including the large car and timeshare in Florida. So, when we tell them no, or if we can do a potluck at our place, they give us a weird look and think of us as not fun or even boring. It’s hard to tell others, and have others accept, your values in life are different than theirs.
Yes, it definitely makes it harder when other people are living extravagant lifestyles and they expect you to live the same way. You’re right that it’s difficult to have others accept your values. It’s okay indulge once in awhile but large car payments and timeshares are such a waste of money.
It’s so natural for other people to envy you. You just have to know who to discuss your finances with. Most people aren’t financially-disciplined. You’re better off, discussing with people who’re on the same wavelength as you.
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